HH Bleed in snare... shotgun?

Discussion in 'rec.audio.pro' started by Hev, Aug 28, 2003.

  1. Hev

    Hev Guest

    Has anyone tried a shotgun mic for snare to avoid HH and other bleed into
    the snare mic?

    I've never read anything about it so the shotguns probably don't cut it, but
    I would be curious to hear from anyone who has tried.

    thanks
    -hev
  2. Scott Dorsey

    Scott Dorsey Guest

    In article <vksjo1q6q7f4cb@corp.supernews.com>, Hev <no@way.com> wrote:
    >Has anyone tried a shotgun mic for snare to avoid HH and other bleed into
    >the snare mic?
    >
    >I've never read anything about it so the shotguns probably don't cut it, but
    >I would be curious to hear from anyone who has tried.


    It won't work... shotguns really aren't effective at such short distances.
    Although, I have seen folks try to use EV 644s on drum kits, the effect
    was, well, not good.

    But miking the snare from the bottom might help, as will using normal
    (non-interference-tube) mikes with really tight patterns, like 441s or
    EV N/D 468s.
    --scott
    --
    "C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
  3. EggHd

    EggHd Guest

    << as will using normal
    (non-interference-tube) mikes with really tight patterns, like 441s or
    EV N/D 468s. >>

    The 441 can sound great on a snare of you have the room for it.


    ---------------------------------------
    "I know enough to know I don't know enough"
  4. Rick Ruskin

    Rick Ruskin Guest

    On Thu, 28 Aug 2003 11:51:09 -0700, "Hev" <no@way.com> wrote:

    >Has anyone tried a shotgun mic for snare to avoid HH and other bleed into
    >the snare mic?
    >
    >I've never read anything about it so the shotguns probably don't cut it, but
    >I would be curious to hear from anyone who has tried.
    >
    >thanks
    >-hev
    >



    Solutions I've come up with:

    1. An M/S mic aimed with the snare as the stereo center.
    2. A double differential mic placed with its back to the high hat
    3. A lavalier padded and taped on the far side of the snare from the
    high hat. (Capsuile pointed any way but up. Needs lots of eq but sits
    well in a mix.


    Rick Ruskin
    Lion Dog Music - Seattle WA
    http://liondogmusic.com
  5. Rob Reedijk

    Rob Reedijk Guest

    Hev <no@way.com> wrote:
    > Has anyone tried a shotgun mic for snare to avoid HH and other bleed into
    > the snare mic?


    > I've never read anything about it so the shotguns probably don't cut it, but
    > I would be curious to hear from anyone who has tried.


    Try a side-address mic like a 409. It is easier to position the null-end
    of the mic at the Hihat.

    Personally, I thinnk mic'ing snares is wrong, but if you are going to
    go ahead and do it...

    Rob R.
  6. Rob Reedijk <reedijk@hera.med.utoronto.ca> wrote :

    > Try a side-address mic like a 409. It is easier to position the
    > null-end of the mic at the Hihat.


    409s are great on snares! I use them a lot for that, especially when a
    drummer has 2-3 different snares

    --
    Bill Gates can't guarantee Windows,
    how are you gonna guarantee my safety..
    --John Crichton - Farscape pilot
  7. Les Cargill

    Les Cargill Guest

    Hev wrote:
    >
    > Has anyone tried a shotgun mic for snare to avoid HH and other bleed into
    > the snare mic?
    >
    > I've never read anything about it so the shotguns probably don't cut it, but
    > I would be curious to hear from anyone who has tried.
    >
    > thanks
    > -hev


    No, but a card pointed at the side of the top rim, more or less
    parallel with the ground gets not-a-lot of bleed. The
    hihat is mostly in the shadow.

    --
    Les Cargill
  8. Ty Ford

    Ty Ford Guest

    In Article <vksjo1q6q7f4cb@corp.supernews.com>, "Hev" <no@way.com> wrote:
    >Has anyone tried a shotgun mic for snare to avoid HH and other bleed into
    >the snare mic?
    >
    >I've never read anything about it so the shotguns probably don't cut it, but
    >I would be curious to hear from anyone who has tried.
    >
    >thanks
    >-hev


    Haven't tried it. Shotguns are very directional at high frequencies, but a
    LOT more onmi directional at mid and low frequencies. In addition those
    interference vanes do some wonky things to phase.

    That new Sanken short shotgun I heard at NAB this past spring might be worth
    trying though.

    Regards,

    Ty Ford



    For Ty Ford V/O demos, audio services and equipment reviews,
    click on http://www.jagunet.com/~tford
  9. ScotFraser

    ScotFraser Guest

    << 409s are great on snares! I use them a lot for that, especially when a
    drummer has 2-3 different snares >>

    And they look cool too. I find they're a bit dark for a lot of snares, though.
    I use them on live gigs, but haven't been knocked out with the 409 in the
    studio on snare.


    Scott Fraser
  10. EganMedia

    EganMedia Guest

    >The 441 can sound great on a snare of you have the room for it.
    >


    A sennheiser 441 is my first-call snare mic. I set it about an inch above the
    head, about two inches out from the rim. It rejects Hi Hat better than
    anything other than the null of a fig 8 (I use 414s almost as often as 441s)
    and has all the snap and sizzle of a 57. I'm a big 441/snare drum fan!


    Joe Egan
    EMP
    Colchester, VT
    www.eganmedia.com
  11. Toolowd

    Toolowd Guest

    I just stopped using hihat mics. get your sound from the overheads and kik
    then fill in.

    Stopped using hihat mics about 6 years ago. not one person has complained.

    Rich
  12. Jeff Maher

    Jeff Maher Guest

    "Toolowd" <toolowd@aol.com> wrote in message
    news:20030830125850.20930.00000119@mb-m21.aol.com...
    > I just stopped using hihat mics. get your sound from the overheads and

    kik
    > then fill in.
    >
    > Stopped using hihat mics about 6 years ago. not one person has

    complained.
    >
    > Rich


    Agreed, but the OP is not asking about micing the hat, he wants to keep HH
    bleed out of his snare mic.

    I've had occasional success by cutting a hole in the center of one of those
    small cardboard frozen pizza thingys, and sticking a SM-57 through it.
    Unfortunately, it kind of negates one of the 57's chief advantages, i.e.
    ease of placement. You can trim it down to size and experiment with size.
    Too big, hard to place and a bit phasey sounding. Too small, doesn't work.

    Honestly, I've had the most luck by just asking the drummer to back off a
    bit on the open hi-hat parts, or failing that, asking him or her to hit the
    drums harder (drummers usually respond MUCH better to the latter
    suggestion).

    Praying he hasn't just started one of those drummer joke threads...

    Jeff Maher
    Garage Mahal Recording
    Austin, Texas

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