Redbook CD/Firewire Drive/Mac

Discussion in 'rec.audio.pro' started by Mike Caffrey, Aug 21, 2003.

  1. Chris Smalt

    Chris Smalt Guest

    EggHd wrote:

    > FYI Spark and Peak burn directly to disc now
    > as well.



    According to their manuals, Spark and Peak only create an image, that
    subsequently gets burned by the MacOS (Spark) and Toast (Peak). Does
    Peak come with a OEM version of Toast?


    Chris
  2. Mike Caffrey

    Mike Caffrey Guest

    In article <20030823151141.05431.00000441@mb-m16.aol.com>, egghd@aol.com
    (EggHd) wrote:

    > << The audio content prevents that in the specific cases I'm haing to deal
    > with. >>
    >
    > This begs for the question "what is the audio content?"
    >

    A bunch of live stuff thats edited to sound like it's continuous.

    I guess maybe I could consolidate the region, make cuts, but then I'd
    still have to make tweaks to cut out the two second gaps that most CD
    burning programs. I can't imagint the cuts not being audible anyway.



    www.monsterisland.com
  3. Mike Caffrey

    Mike Caffrey Guest

    In article <230820031759006294%ulysses@rollmusic.com>, Justin Ulysses
    Morse <ulysses@rollmusic.com> wrote:

    > Mike Caffrey <mike@monsterisland.com> wrote:
    >
    > > In article <20030822121313.08111.00001507@mb-m06.aol.com>, egghd@aol.com
    > > (EggHd) wrote:
    > >
    > > > << I've been doing live albums that are one solid audiofile and need PQ
    > > > codes. >>
    > > >
    > > > I don't know what software you are using, but you could do this with

    > > regions in
    > > > Pro Tools and export to Jam or MLCD and I believe it will work.
    > > >

    > >
    > > The audio content prevents that in the specific cases I'm haing to

    deal with.
    >
    >
    > I think I understand what you're saying, and I think you're right about
    > JAM but not about MLCD.
    >
    > ulysses


    Well now I'm sort of lost with what your saying, but this originated with
    me trying to find a replacement for MLCD since I can't use it on my new
    G4.

    Someone sent me an email with a description of Toast/Jam off Berklee's
    website. It said that Jam burns redbook standard CDs.



    www.monsterisland.com
  4. Mike Caffrey

    Mike Caffrey Guest

    In article <20030823191652.05431.00000446@mb-m16.aol.com>, egghd@aol.com
    (EggHd) wrote:

    > << I think I understand what you're saying, and I think you're right about
    > JAM but not about MLCD. >>
    >
    > I thought both Jam and MLCD will imprt regions and set them up as tracks.
    >

    That's correct.

    I think he was saying take the long region and cut them into smaller
    regions so that you don't have to ad index points - each region is it's
    own index.



    www.monsterisland.com
  5. Justin Ulysses Morse <ulysses@rollmusic.com> wrote:

    > LeBaron & Alrich <walkinay@thegrid.net> wrote:


    > > WB Pro 2.2 supports shitloads of FW burners. I run it with the internal
    > > in the TiBook and with an exernal Glyph/Plextor FW burner.


    > Hey, that's awesome. I was using 2.0, and now that I look at it again
    > I can't be positive it wouldn't see FW drives.


    Emagic offered a demo download of WB 1.something that didn't support FW
    drives, and then it tiik them a while (vut not ages) to get the 2.xxx
    iterations up to handling most FW drives. With 2.2 they covered what
    they said were all Apple internal drives and started adding FW drives at
    a prodigious rate.

    > I'll have to try again.
    > Isn't Emagic the company that got bought up by Apple? Will they
    > discontinue WB Pro?


    Yes, Apple bought them, but word is that WBP will grow, not disappear.
    I'd imagine something like integrated DVD-recordable of some kinds, and
    so forth. And I wouldn't mind some expansion of the editing
    capabilities, unless it's my own stupidity combined with their manual
    that's keeping me from some of it.

    --
    hank alrich * secret mountain
    audio recording * music production * sound reinforcement
    "If laughter is the best medicine let's take a double dose"
  6. Mike Caffrey <mike@monsterisland.com> wrote:

    > In article <20030822121313.08111.00001507@mb-m06.aol.com>, egghd@aol.com
    > (EggHd) wrote:


    > > << I've been doing live albums that are one solid audiofile and need PQ
    > > codes. >>


    > > I don't know what software you are using, but you could do this with

    > regions in
    > > Pro Tools and export to Jam or MLCD and I believe it will work.


    > The audio content prevents that in the specific cases I'm haing to deal with.


    I record whole sets into Waveburner Pro and then do what you're
    describing.

    --
    hank alrich * secret mountain
    audio recording * music production * sound reinforcement
    "If laughter is the best medicine let's take a double dose"
  7. Chris Smalt <smalt@wanadoo.nl> wrote:

    > And when you
    > begin a new session in WB, the Wave Window is obscured by the other
    > windows.


    You can tell it to remember what your windows setup pref is. I get the
    wave window across the top of the screen, the region window lower left,
    and the track window lower right. I sometimes use the meter window
    floating over one of the lower ones, but not as part of my usual config.

    --
    hank alrich * secret mountain
    audio recording * music production * sound reinforcement
    "If laughter is the best medicine let's take a double dose"
  8. Justin Ulysses Morse <ulysses@rollmusic.com> wrote:

    > In article <1g04xr2.151f1ltyhbwngN%walkinay@thegrid.net>, LeBaron &
    > Alrich <walkinay@thegrid.net> wrote:


    > > EggHd <egghd@aol.com> wrote:


    > > > << So i bring a single
    > > > large file into MLCD and then add track numbers throughout that one
    > > > item. >>


    > > > Where do you work on the spacing?


    > > In Waverburner Pro you can spec a number (i.e., amount of time) for each
    > > space.


    > I'm not sure we're talking about the same thing, but I *think* WBP will
    > do what I want. I want to put ONE sound file into the program, and
    > tell it to have 15 different CD tracks, each with different pre-gap
    > times, and the audio will continue to play during the pre-gap. No
    > digital silence anywhere except the first two and last two seconds of
    > the whole CD.


    I track live sets right into WBP and do just that. Works champly.

    --
    ha
  9. LeBaron & Alrich <walkinay@thegrid.net> wrote:

    > tiik them a while (vut not ages)


    Keeerapp, more coffee, Hank!

    --
    ha
  10. EggHd

    EggHd Guest

    << I guess maybe I could consolidate the region, make cuts, but then I'd
    still have to make tweaks to cut out the two second gaps that most CD
    burning programs. >>

    You can set those to 0 seconds. There wil be no gap and it's a global
    preference setting.





    ---------------------------------------
    "I know enough to know I don't know enough"
  11. EggHd

    EggHd Guest

    << Well now I'm sort of lost with what your saying, but this originated with
    me trying to find a replacement for MLCD since I can't use it on my new
    G4. >>

    I have replaced MLCD with Toast with Jam and find it to be a worthy substitute
    other then the few gripes mentioned earlier.



    ---------------------------------------
    "I know enough to know I don't know enough"
  12. EggHd

    EggHd Guest

    << According to their manuals, Spark and Peak only create an image, that
    subsequently gets burned by the MacOS (Spark) and Toast (Peak). Does
    Peak come with a OEM version of Toast? >>

    From what I read on both websites, the newest version of each support direct
    disc burning.




    ---------------------------------------
    "I know enough to know I don't know enough"
  13. Mike Caffrey <mike@monsterisland.com> wrote:

    > Well now I'm sort of lost with what your saying, but this originated with
    > me trying to find a replacement for MLCD since I can't use it on my new
    > G4.
    >
    > Someone sent me an email with a description of Toast/Jam off Berklee's
    > website. It said that Jam burns redbook standard CDs.



    Sorry. I think you're the guy who was talking about making CDs of live
    performances and wanting to import a single "concert" file into your
    disc burning program. Maybe it was somebody else. Anyway, that's
    similar to the way I work and I have found Jam to be pretty useless for
    this kind of work, though maybe I just needed to mess around more.
    Wave Burner Pro definitely seems to be the way to go now that I know
    more about it. Support for modern burners, continued development, a
    modest editor, full control of indexing, pregaps, etc. and even support
    for VST plug-ins. Sounds like a wiener to me. I will be spending some
    time with it.

    ulysses
  14. EggHd <egghd@aol.com> wrote:

    > << I guess maybe I could consolidate the region, make cuts, but then I'd
    > still have to make tweaks to cut out the two second gaps that most CD
    > burning programs. >>
    >
    > You can set those to 0 seconds. There wil be no gap and it's a global
    > preference setting.



    That sucks just as badly. What happens when you have 20 seconds of
    applause between cuts? Setting the gap to 0 means you have to listen
    to all that crap, no matter what, and it kind of ruins the disc for
    radio play. With MLCD, you can set the pregap to be 20 seconds, and
    all the applause can be in that pregap. So when you cue up a single
    track, you simply don't hear the applause. It gets skipped because the
    track begins playing at index 1 and stops at the next track's index 0.

    ulysses
  15. Chris Smalt

    Chris Smalt Guest

    Hank wrote:

    > Keeerapp, more coffee, Hank!



    Nah, just nudge the keyboard a hair to the left.


    Chris
  16. Mike Caffrey

    Mike Caffrey Guest

    In article <240820031819099022%ulysses@rollmusic.com>, Justin Ulysses
    Morse <ulysses@rollmusic.com> wrote:

    > EggHd <egghd@aol.com> wrote:
    >
    > > << I guess maybe I could consolidate the region, make cuts, but then I'd
    > > still have to make tweaks to cut out the two second gaps that most CD
    > > burning programs. >>
    > >
    > > You can set those to 0 seconds. There wil be no gap and it's a global
    > > preference setting.

    >
    >
    > That sucks just as badly. What happens when you have 20 seconds of
    > applause between cuts? Setting the gap to 0 means you have to listen
    > to all that crap, no matter what, and it kind of ruins the disc for
    > radio play. With MLCD, you can set the pregap to be 20 seconds, and
    > all the applause can be in that pregap. So when you cue up a single
    > track, you simply don't hear the applause. It gets skipped because the
    > track begins playing at index 1 and stops at the next track's index 0.
    >
    > ulysses


    Heh. None of them have 20 seconds of applause in the middle and nothing is
    editied in that doesn't need to be heard.



    www.monsterisland.com
  17. David Nobel

    David Nobel Guest

    egghd@aol.com (EggHd) wrote in message news:<20030824121625.28426.00000631@mb-m18.aol.com>...
    > << According to their manuals, Spark and Peak only create an image, that
    > subsequently gets burned by the MacOS (Spark) and Toast (Peak). Does
    > Peak come with a OEM version of Toast? >>
    >
    > From what I read on both websites, the newest version of each support direct
    > disc burning.
    >

    Warning: I am new to mastering altogether, so my comments are not
    informed by much experience. However, I did a LOT of research and
    talked to many people before buying the new Spark XL, as opposed to
    Waveburner Pro. (I had already demoed Peak and didn't like the
    interface.) Here are the major factors in my decision:

    1) Spark XL supports direct burning in Red Book format using the Mac's
    own disc burner utility.

    2) Though both TC Electronics (Spark) and E-magic (Waveburner) are
    German companies, E-magic is notoriously inscrutable about ongoing
    development of Waveburner, in spite of being owned by Apple. Couldn't
    get straight answers from the E-magic U.S. sales/support team who
    openly expressed frustration with the German management and
    development teams. Bottom line: Spark XL is well into its first
    generation OS X release while Waveburner will still only say that an
    OS X release is "planned' while refusing to commit to even an
    approximate release date.

    3) Spark is reputed to have set the industry standard with its new
    high-end word length reduction system, which noise-shapes high bit
    rate recordings down to Audio CD format. (Even E-magic's U.S. sales
    team admitted this to me.) This can audibly improve CDs mastered from
    20-bit and higher recordings.

    4) Spark includes the FX Machine, a really nifty real-time effects
    matrix with bundled high-quality plug-ins. It also comes with a good,
    real-time audio restoration system. Plus some of its
    mastering-specific features such as the cut editor and batch audio
    file processor are excellent.

    5) In its favor, Waveburner Pro is considered by many to have a
    better, more intuitive user interface.

    These were all things that were very important to me, but others may
    have different priorities.

    -- David
  18. EggHd

    EggHd Guest

    << That sucks just as badly. What happens when you have 20 seconds of
    applause between cuts? Setting the gap to 0 means you have to listen
    to all that crap, no matter what, and it kind of ruins the disc for
    radio play. >>

    I thought you were talking about exporting all the files with PQ and index
    points out of another prgram and you were wondering about the 2 sec pauses you
    would need to edit out. I was saying that jam can not have the pauses if you
    choose.

    It's not difficult to make the applause a seperate track.





    ---------------------------------------
    "I know enough to know I don't know enough"
  19. Chris Smalt

    Chris Smalt Guest

    EggHd wrote:

    > I have replaced MLCD with Toast with Jam and find it to be a worthy substitute
    > other then the few gripes mentioned earlier.



    I still use SoundDesigner playlists a lot. I wish there was a current
    program that could read them right. Jam acts as if it does, but it
    messes them up badly.


    Chris
  20. EggHd <egghd@aol.com> wrote:

    > << That sucks just as badly. What happens when you have 20 seconds of
    > applause between cuts? Setting the gap to 0 means you have to listen
    > to all that crap, no matter what, and it kind of ruins the disc for
    > radio play. >>
    >
    > I thought you were talking about exporting all the files with PQ and index
    > points out of another prgram and you were wondering about the 2 sec pauses you
    > would need to edit out. I was saying that jam can not have the pauses if you
    > choose.


    No, when I export from another program (SDII) I have just one file for
    the whole album, and I don't have any PQ or index or pauses at all.
    There's just 45 minutes of sound. Noise, then music, then noise, then
    music, then noise, etc. til all the songs are done. The noise is
    important, and it needs to go in the right places. Which is between
    the CD tracks, not during them.

    > It's not difficult to make the applause a seperate track.


    No, you don't want the applause to be a separate track either, because
    then when people put the disc into a jukebox and set it for shuffle,
    they would occasionally hear a track that's just applause. I meant
    exactly what I said, which is that the segue between songs needs to
    occur between index 0 and index 1. I'm not talking about CD tracks,
    but track indexes. And I'm not talking about having multiple indexes
    in a CD track, just 0 and 1. If you skip to a particular CD track, it
    always starts playing at index 1. If you rewind from there, you're in
    the pre-gap or "negative time" where the clock counts backwards.

    BTW I'm using "applause" generically here, I mean any kind of
    between-song banter that adds to album continuity but would be annoying
    when cueing up a single track for radio play, "mix tapes", or jukebox
    shuffling.

    Get it?

    ulysses

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